Hooked on Ebonics?

An article taken from CNN.

Spoiler:

DEKALB COUNTY, Georgia (CNN) -- While Ebonics rages as a hot topic in the spotlight of American media, so called Black English has played a quiet role in an Atlanta area school district for more than a decade.
About 600 students in the Dekalb County School District just east of Atlanta are taking a course known as "bi-dialectal communication."
Here, Ebonics is considered not a language, but a dialect. Specifically, it's called "home speech," and it's not considered appropriate for the classroom.
The course focuses on more than just the non-standard English of Ebonics. The students learn they must project, enunciate and gesture properly to communicate.
Part of the class involves critiquing a videotaped actor violating several rules of effective communication.
This is the 11th year of the federally funded bi-dialectal program. Administrators cite rising test scores in language arts and reading as evidence that it works.
Parents also seem to approve: "If I had something like this when I was growing up, I probably would have went further," said parent Jannita Hightower.
Added Gregory Maxwell: "If you want someone that's going to go places, you want to be able to talk right."
Teachers agree. Ebonics, while a legitimate form of speech at home, will likely hinder children at school and eventually their careers.
"We have a responsibility to tell them that, and I think to tell them anything beyond that may be setting them up for an unrealistic view of our society," said Kelli Harris-Wright, bi-dialectal program director.
Teachers say sometimes their students take pride in going home and correcting the grammar of their parents.

Do you believe that teaching Ebonics in school would be beneficial to the future leaders of tomorrow? When would Ebonics ever be used or come in handy and what are some of the downsides to teaching this language to students?

To me, i feel like this is just another idea that racist people are trying to use to separate themselves from blacks by allowing them to learn more about a language that would ultimately never be used somewhere like the workplace or serious conversations. Teaching Ebonics also gives the schools a bad look since schools are ultimately supposed to be a place for preparing students for the future right? Well, in the real world Ebonics is not a language that would ever be needed for anything besides casual talk between two uneducated people. Ebonics to me is a form of idiocy disguised as a language which does nothing but further continue the amount of idiots in the world and giving help to people who deserve no shut needed help (speaking of racists).

So...what do you think? If Ebonics was taught at your school (when or while you were there) would you take it or agree with the idea?

It shouldn't be formalised.

By the way, your prejudices bleed like capped motherfucker without private healthcare. First, not only is it not a language, it isn't even a dialect so much as a comprehensive slang set. Second, uneducated does not equal intellectually inferior. Thirdly, educational institutions are more than preparation for the workforce.

Smell ya later, homes.

This is old news, I remember some people in Oakland trying to install this in classrooms a couple years ago.

Originally Posted by NaklsonofNakkl

Well, in the real world Ebonics is not a language that would ever be needed for anything besides casual talk between two uneducated people. ?

Sounds like this course should be taught to undercover cops.

Originally Posted by Devo

This is old news, I remember some people in Oakland trying to install this in classrooms a couple years ago.



Sounds like this course should be taught to undercover cops.

just cause it is old doesn't mean that there aren't something new and points that weren't brought up now available to us. And if our police force learned Ebonics it would be more humorous than it would be beneficial...(i hear a good plot for Reno 911!) In all honesty, yes, Ebonics is considered a 'foreign language' and yes, '[high]schools are made to prepare you for the real world'. Just because school offers things that might not be meant for the 'real world' like art doesn't mean it is not a place for preparing for the future. I mean, even P.E. has it's future insights. All i am saying is what if Ebonics was turned into a regular language class?

Originally Posted by NaklsonofNakkl

just cause it is old doesn't mean that there aren't something new and points that weren't brought up now available to us. And if our police force learned Ebonics it would be more humorous than it would be beneficial...(i hear a good plot for Reno 911!) In all honesty, yes, Ebonics is considered a 'foreign language' and yes, '[high]schools are made to prepare you for the real world'. Just because school offers things that might not be meant for the 'real world' like art doesn't mean it is not a place for preparing for the future. I mean, even P.E. has it's future insights. All i am saying is what if Ebonics was turned into a regular language class?

That's where you're wrong, it's not a language at all. Technically it'd be a dialect but I don't think you can even label it that either. Also how the hell would it be "foreign" when its roots are in America?

Originally Posted by Devo

That's where you're wrong, it's not a language AT ALL. Also how the hell would it be "foreign" when its roots are in America?

Well, actually, it is a language! and just because it is from American doesn't mean it isn't foreign, the word just means that it is not English because English is the national language and any other language is foreign.

Originally Posted by NaklsonofNakkl

Well, actually, it is a language! and just because it is from American doesn't mean it isn't foreign, the word just means that it is not English because English is the national language and any other language is foreign.

Are you seriously using a wikipedia article? Also it says:

Quote:

is a type variety (dialect, ethnolect and sociolect) of the American English language

So even your wikipedia mentions it as a dialect not a "language."


Here's the CIA

Quote:

English 82.1%, Spanish 10.7%, other Indo-European 3.8%, Asian and Pacific island 2.7%, other 0.7%

Hmm no Ebonics listed here.

Originally Posted by NaklsonofNakkl

Well, actually, it is a language! and just because it is from American doesn't mean it isn't foreign, the word just means that it is not English because English is the national language and any other language is foreign.

You know nothing, you are nothing, please leave your school because they have failed you.

Slang is not a new language.

Closed.

Is it just me, or does it seem more like that article's saying they're teaching a class where they treat students as though Ebonics is their first language and they need to learn proper methods of speaking English?

I don't see how it's really that different from any other speaking skills course. =/

(Reopened to see if I'm just a moron and can't interpret a news article correctly.)

I think you're right about that.

Also, it looks like the program has led to rising test scores, and better communication skills for the students. If they are correct about the end result, then no one should have a problem with it.

Quote:

"If I had something like this when I was growing up, I probably would have went further,"

Indeed

Originally Posted by Devo

Sounds like this course should be taught to undercover cops.

Seconded!

I love the verb conjugation that ebonics uses. Rather than the obviously confusing "I am" "You are" "He/She is" "They are" "We are," the verb "to be" becomes "I be" "you be" "he/she be" "they be" "we be."

“I can't even talk the way these people talk. 'Why you ain't, 'Where you is'… And I blamed the kid until I heard the mother talk. Everybody knows it's important to speak English except these knuckleheads. You can't be a doctor with that kind of crap coming out of your mouth.” -Bill Cosby

I don't see how it helps to have it in the schools at all. I mean, you go to any normal English class and they won't accept Ebonics either, so what makes this so special? Sounds like a waste of time since you should be able to get the same effect by teaching proper English without having to involve Ebonics or whatever other slang is popular with the students.

Originally Posted by NaklsonofNakkl

An article taken from CNN.

Spoiler:

DEKALB COUNTY, Georgia (CNN) -- While Ebonics rages as a hot topic in the spotlight of American media, so called Black English has played a quiet role in an Atlanta area school district for more than a decade.
About 600 students in the Dekalb County School District just east of Atlanta are taking a course known as "bi-dialectal communication."
Here, Ebonics is considered not a language, but a dialect. Specifically, it's called "home speech," and it's not considered appropriate for the classroom.
The course focuses on more than just the non-standard English of Ebonics. The students learn they must project, enunciate and gesture properly to communicate.
Part of the class involves critiquing a videotaped actor violating several rules of effective communication.
This is the 11th year of the federally funded bi-dialectal program. Administrators cite rising test scores in language arts and reading as evidence that it works.
Parents also seem to approve: "If I had something like this when I was growing up, I probably would have went further," said parent Jannita Hightower.
Added Gregory Maxwell: "If you want someone that's going to go places, you want to be able to talk right."
Teachers agree. Ebonics, while a legitimate form of speech at home, will likely hinder children at school and eventually their careers.
"We have a responsibility to tell them that, and I think to tell them anything beyond that may be setting them up for an unrealistic view of our society," said Kelli Harris-Wright, bi-dialectal program director.
Teachers say sometimes their students take pride in going home and correcting the grammar of their parents.

Do you believe that teaching Ebonics in school would be beneficial to the future leaders of tomorrow? When would Ebonics ever be used or come in handy and what are some of the downsides to teaching this language to students?

To me, i feel like this is just another idea that racist people are trying to use to separate themselves from blacks by allowing them to learn more about a language that would ultimately never be used somewhere like the workplace or serious conversations. Teaching Ebonics also gives the schools a bad look since schools are ultimately supposed to be a place for preparing students for the future right? Well, in the real world Ebonics is not a language that would ever be needed for anything besides casual talk between two uneducated people. Ebonics to me is a form of idiocy disguised as a language which does nothing but further continue the amount of idiots in the world and giving help to people who deserve no shut needed help (speaking of racists).

So...what do you think? If Ebonics was taught at your school (when or while you were there) would you take it or agree with the idea?

Wait huh? This article is about the school teaching formal English and correcting the students in order to prepare them for the work force. The schools acknowledge that ebonics is fine for the home, but not really in the work force. Oh well you're banned so what does it matter?

Learning Ebonics may be a helpful skill, but English is the main language spoken within America and Bush is supposedly planning on making English the official language of America (technically, it isn't yet). I agree that knowledge of Ebonics could help teachers understand what students are saying, but to consider it as an actual dialect and have it as a possible requirement would be opening up a can of worms.

Yes, a lot of people do speak Ebonics, but a lot of people speak internet speak and Klingon as well, so by letting Ebonics become a dialect could open up a whole new problem of people inventing their own "dialects". Granted, I guess Klingon could count as a language, even though it's just some made-up language for Star Trek, but nonetheless there is already a huge split between African American and Caucasian culture and this could create and even bigger split. Would this really contribute to unity?

If anyone else replies without having read this thread, they get banned from Political.

Well, I'm not going to say much about whether ebonics in schools is a good thing or not, except that I think that this is the most retarded shit I've heard in ages. But as far as the language/dialect debate goes, ebonics/BEV (black English vernacular) has a standardizable grammar and vocabulary that is different from standard English, and so it is at least a dialect. Stephen Pinker in his "The Language Instinct" actually goes into this topic of BEV to some extent. Is it a language? Hard to say - linguists themselves have a hard time telling languages and dialects apart. The running joke about this is that a language is a dialect with an army. Just so you know.

I think it makes sense to teach kids the difference between what is acceptable at home versus what is expected of you on a professional level. That being said, I've faced repeated discrimination due to my accent and certain aspects of my dialect. I can't quite decide if it's these kids who have to change, or society's perception of what it is to "sound educated." I have a University degree, and people still treat me like a retard because of my dialect and accent. Is it my fault or theirs? Iono.

Also, it's bloody amazing how confused people were by that article. Even the poster didn't know what it was about. o_o