The "Line"

Originally Posted by of pom

So can you answer my thing about why loving a person is somehow less important than being able to go inside a room on sunday for a couple of hours?

Actually, you do a good job of making her point for her. She sees it a bit differently than going inside a room for a couple of hours on Sunday, and want's someone for who also shares this significance.

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Originally Posted by a_licenwondrland
I married my cousin, although he's not a close cousin, and it's not as big a deal as people make it out to be. It's very common in many cultures to marry a relative.

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I wouldn't date anyone of another race or religion. There are just too many cultural differences, and marriage is hard enough without all the disagreements that would arise as a result of being raised in such different environments.

Here, ladies and gentlemen, we see Alice's pool of suitors. Now we know why she married her cousin.

I think, Alice, that you shouldn't be telling people HOW HARD it is to jive with a person from a different cultural, religious, or ethnic background. This is YOUR preference, and to some of us, that shit is completely inconsequential.

Of course, if you're looking for the male clone of yourself, you'll only continue to see things in tunnel vision. There ain't no harm in learning new shit, woman.

Originally Posted by Secret Squirrel

She sees it a bit differently than going inside a room for a couple of hours on Sunday, and want's someone for who also shares this significance.

Yeah! So obviously she needs to marry somebody who ALREADY shares those feelings because LAZY!

In our next episode, Alice explains why evangelism is so important!

Originally Posted by of pom

So can you answer my thing about why loving a person is somehow less important than being able to go inside a room on sunday for a couple of hours?

Originally Posted by of pom

Please?

*sigh* I really wanted to stay out of this thread, in case you hadn't noticed. I'm not getting anywhere and neither is anyone else.

I never said that loving a person is less important than being able to go inside a room for a couple of hours, pom. I used...whatever it was I said...as an illustration. I just wanted the people who I felt were labeling me as racist to understand that I don't think I'm any better than any other group of people, and that in fact I found some of them quite attractive (except asians...sorry).

I guess I didn't do a very good job, though. I was trying to explain that even though I like them just fine, I wouldn't get into a situation to begin with that might lead to me falling in love with someone who - chances are - I don't have much in common with. I probably wouldn't go out with someone from another race or religion in the first place, much less get a room with them, because relationships start out with that one first date.

I feel like I'm stirring the pot here, and I don't want that. The bottom line is, I chose not to even CHANCE getting involved with someone who would likely have very a different, possibly very incompatible lifestyle from mine. I really don't see what the big deal is, anyway. It's not like we're removing a potential mate for someone from the pool of candidates or anything, since I'm already married.

Originally Posted by Manis Tricuspis

Yeah! So obviously she needs to marry somebody who ALREADY shares those feelings because LAZY!

In our next episode, Alice explains why evangelism is so important!

Look who came out of his den, just to say hi to me.
:fish:

I think most of you are being too critical of Alice for a few reasons:

1.) Alice is from a previous generation. A lot of things have changed in 20 years. Racial, cultural, religious, and gender differences are a lot less important than in previous generations, even blurred.

2.) Most of you would 'draw the line' at dating someone who was an evangelical fundamentalist Christian, or who was a rabid pro-war Bush supporter. (And I'm not talking about flings or short-term sexual relationships ... I mean for long-term with potential of raising a family.) It's not because you're closed-minded or intolerant; it's because you have a clear idea what kind of life you want to have.

I know it's easy and fun giving Alice a hard time, because she does give us a lot of material to work with, but this issue is just lame.

Gee thanks, SS. =/

Originally Posted by Secret Squirrel

1.) Alice is from a previous generation. A lot of things have changed in 20 years. Racial, cultural, religious, and gender differences are a lot less important than in previous generations, even blurred.

Alice is hardly from "a different generation." She's rather young, from what I understand. While she's only ONE generation ahead of me (I think), she has been around for mostly the same shit. She probably graduatedhigh school sometime in the 80s? Maybe 90's? Theres not a HUGE relationship gap between then and now. Don't act like she's 60, SS.

I think she's just a part of the South. ^_^ (Just laugh at that Alice. *SMILE*)

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2.) Most of you would 'draw the line' at dating someone who was an evangelical fundamentalist Christian, or who was a rabid pro-war Bush supporter. (And I'm not talking about flings or short-term sexual relationships ... I mean for long-term with potential of raising a family.) It's not because you're closed-minded or intolerant; it's because you have a clear idea what kind of life you want to have.

It really depends on each individual.

The REASONS she listed aren't the same as everyone else has. Man, if she wants to stay within her own pool of suitors which is pretty much limited to whatever she WANTS - thats her call. Apparently she thinks, its like, impossible to have a relationship work out with a Jew because of trivial, petty bullshit. Which, you know, NEVER makes sense to me personally.

And I am sure you can understand why a lot of us are in the same boat. We think it's pretty stupid, I guess. But again, she's got her own guidelines - and she's got that right dude. I know I just DONT GET IT.

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I know it's easy and fun giving Alice a hard time, because she does give us a lot of material to work with, but this issue is just lame.

Maybe you're lame. =p

Just try to understand WHY people are all over her for it. Its a matter of difference in opinion and priority. Don't act like we're the bad guys here - NONE of us are. INCLUDING Alice.

Originally Posted by AliceNWondrland

I married my cousin, although he's not a close cousin, and it's not as big a deal as people make it out to be. It's very common in many cultures to marry a relative.

I'm probably going to get flamed for this, but here's my "line": I wouldn't date anyone of another race or religion. There are just too many cultural differences, and marriage is hard enough without all the disagreements that would arise as a result of being raised in such different environments.

The first thing I thought of when reading this was "West Virginia, Virginia, or one of the Carolinas." Boy was I correct. You guys are fucked up down there.

Originally Posted by Spike

The first thing I thought of when reading this was "West Virginia, Virginia, or one of the Carolinas." Boy was I correct. You guys are fucked up down there.

Oddly enough, we say the same thing about people from California.

Originally Posted by AliceNWondrland

Oddly enough, we say the same thing about people from California.

Fair enough.

But I go to college here in VA (unfortunately), and everyone here talks about how they would love to move to California. Maybe that's just VA though. And how did you know I was from CA? I don't have a profile. Post history?

Alice, I'm still curious what you do about mixed breeds. Like, fine, I can pretend I get you not wanting to be in a relationship with anyone outside of your race and religion, but what do you do for people that are, say, half white and half hispanic?

I haven't actually put that much thought into it, to tell you the truth. I'm just going to be completely honest and admit that I probably wouldn't go out with them in the first place, just to be on the safe side.

Side Note: I find it interesting that people can use derrogatory terms like "mixed breeds" and that's hunky-dory, but it's not OK that not everyone wants to date outside their race. Hmmm...

To Spike: Yeah, it was your post history.

How is mixed breeds derogatory? I could understand if he said "half white half nigger", but how can you describe someone of mixed genealogy without saying something that essentially means mixed? And don't try to tell me melado isn't any less derogatory, heh.

Originally Posted by AliceNWondrland

I feel like I'm stirring the pot here, and I don't want that. The bottom line is, I chose not to even CHANCE getting involved with someone who would likely have very a different, possibly very incompatible lifestyle from mine. I really don't see what the big deal is, anyway. It's not like we're removing a potential mate for someone from the pool of candidates or anything, since I'm already married.

I don’t think people’s problem with you in this thread is your personal choices and how you chose to live your life, it’s more so your attitude – or at least, original attitude.

You went about the situation as though cultural barriers (which were identified by you as their race) are - in all absolute fact - a troublesome, unavoidable dilemma. Even when you attempted to escape tunnel vision and identify with other people by saying things like:

Originally Posted by AliceNWondrland

Those kinds of differences are perfectly acceptable between friends, but in a marriage - NO WAY. If you guys want to deal with that, fine.

You’re still implying that these barriers are troublesome unavoidable dilemmas, and if people want to deal with it, than that’s okay with you.

What you either don’t understand, or aren’t really expressing very well, is that to plenty of people, the same thing you perceive as a barrier isn’t a barrier at all. That’s probably why people are arguing with you.

I'm half Jew and half Christian (which, oddly enough, makes neither) and I don't really see what would be deragatory about a mixed breed. I mean, it doesn't seem any worse than something like 'hybrid' which makes it sound like non-mixeds are inferior to mixeds.

Alice, how about someone who had one or two grandparents that were of a different race? Or, let's say you're going out with someone that you think is completely white, but upon meeting their parents you find out one of them isn't 'white' (a term I think is already hard enough to define)? Would you break up with them after finding out?

Originally Posted by Secret Squirrel

Most of you would 'draw the line' at dating someone who was an evangelical fundamentalist Christian, or who was a rabid pro-war Bush supporter.

Well, obviously everyone would draw the line somewhere, that's the whole point of the thread. Alice is getting the abuse she's getting not because she's drawn a line, but because the line basically only extends as far as she can reach without having to get up. Saying "Oh, you guys wouldn't date transsexual Branch Davidian trapeze artists, so you're all hypocrites!" kind of misses the point. Our "exclude" lists are collectively about as small as Alice's "include" list, which is why it's all so alarming to us.

She's entitled to her own preferences, obviously, but she knows by now what kind of shit will be flung at her for it and she goes and defends it anyway. It's all a bit masochistic. But she's from the past, and maybe banging your head against the wall was popular then! Along with sock-hops and doing the twist!

Originally Posted by RacinReaver

I'm half Jew and half Christian (which, oddly enough, makes neither) and I don't really see what would be deragatory about a mixed breed. I mean, it doesn't seem any worse than something like 'hybrid' which makes it sound like non-mixeds are inferior to mixeds.

I just call them mudbloods.

Originally Posted by Manis Tricuspis

Well, obviously everyone would draw the line somewhere, that's the whole point of the thread. Alice is getting the abuse she's getting not because she's drawn a line, but because the line basically only extends as far as she can reach without having to get up. Saying "Oh, you guys wouldn't date transsexual Branch Davidian trapeze artists, so you're all hypocrites!" kind of misses the point. Our "exclude" lists are collectively about as small as Alice's "include" list, which is why it's all so alarming to us.

She limited herself to White Christians.

She lives in the South. That's likely the majority demographic there, so it isn't quite as tight a limit as you claim.

[ My example was a much broader group than "transexual Branch Davidian Trapeze artists". Maybe as much as 25% of the country. ]

It's not what she limits herself to so much as how she defends herself.